Broken rods, obligations, and expectations

[MAW]

Ever listen to people talk about how great everything about a restaurant is but when you go you find that, though the food was good, the preparation was long the portions were small the service slow and the price premium. They may have met their obligations but you end up more upset than you would otherwise have been because they didn't live up to your expectations.
Thats me with Kistler
I had heard and read about Kistler rods for some time before our local tackle brothel started handling them. I bought a Helium LTA He66mc and I loved it. At two week intervals (easier to hide in the check book) for the next six weeks, I picked up another He66mc and two He66mhc's. I Loved them all. Many of the guys I know that had bought the He66mhc rods were having breakage issues. But not me, I am very easy on my stuff. Kistler was taking care of the broken rods but several of the guys quit Kistler altogether because of the dependability issues.
Then it happened to me. During a trip to KY Lake, in a matter of two hours, I broke the tip off both He66mhc's. One broke under the wrap on the tip top and the other about an inch below the tip top. I had not slammed, banged, or stepped on them - they just broke on a cast.
I called Kister the following Monday and was told to send them in and they would get back to me about replacement costs and shipping. So I did. I Shipped them the same day and received confirmation from USPS they were delivered to Kistler on Thursday. 10 WORK DAYS LATER I had still not heard a word so I called Kistler again. That is when I heard for the first time, my fault I know, that the Kistler rod warranty was "free repair if possible", "free replacement for 90 days", "$35 replacement up to a year" "25% discount on replacement after that".
I was informed that they would replace one of my rods for $35 but the other would be 25% off the price of a new one. I asked to talk to Trey or Ryan because surely there was some mistake. I got to talk to Ryan and was informed quite frankly that, regardless of how other people had been treated, Kistler had changed their policy and was sticking to the warranty - period. Though I didn't like it, I asked if they could put a tip on the rod they weren't going to replace. Ryan said he would go look at the rod and call me right back. This time, I waited for six hours before calling back and found out they would fix the other one. We made the financial arrangements and I waited, Three days later, I got a call from Monique, who is an absolute pleasure to talk to, informing me that the replacement rod was out of stock and would be shipped in about 10 days but they would ship the repaired one if I wanted. Fine

So, here's my take on Kistler
I love the rods but they break.
10 work days should have been enough time to let me know what was going on.
Don't tell me you will call me right back and then not do it.
Give Monique more money. She has been the only bright spot in this whole ordeal.
Kistler has met their obligations, but has fallen way short of my expectations.

I have sold all my Kistlers. I refuse to support a company I feel has let me down.
If you are going to stick by the warranty fine, but treat everyone the same. Meaning that my experience should become the new expectation.

[Seymour]

I am curious what the Kistler response to this will be. Their warranty is the ONLY reason I am not switching out every Loomis rod in my arsenal to Kistler. They claim a "World Class, No Hassle, Lifetime Limited Warranty"... but upon reading the fine print, it is anything but. It is more of a tiered warranty and after a year, you are pretty much hosed.

I have the Helium APC 6'9", the Magnesium Crankbait rod and the Magnesium All Purpose Spinning rod and absolutley LOVE them, especially the crankbait rod... best I have ever used and cranking is my thing. But, unless Kistler offers a warranty more along the lines of Loomis, I won't switch out my other rods. I'd even pay a little more for a Kistler if they offered a Loomis-like warranty. And I know more people than you might think who feel the same way. (Go on some forums and ask) Fishing tournaments, I love the fact that I can have a replacement Loomis rod very quickly for $50, if necessary, regardless of how it broke. And I rarely break a rod, maybe 3 in 15 years. I do understand the fact that if a rod breaks after a year, it was probably not a manufacturing defect. But, when you fish tournaments, you can't be waiting weeks for a replacement and the convenience of the Loomis warranty is unbeatable.

I do feel that Kistler is a better rod than Loomis... but just slightly better. Loomis is still a great rod. And when you factor in the warranty, it is not worth it to me to switch all my rods to Kistler. I have to stay mainly with Loomis... although my 2 Kistlers get plenty of use! I won't use the Loomis Crankbait rods.

I've read Trey's explanation for the warranty and I see his points. It's a decision of his on how to run his business. I just wonder if he is costing himself business. Maybe things are going so well for them it doesn't matter. The high end bass rod market is getting saturated and more and more competitive every day.

Wishing for a better warranty,

Seymour

[kistlero]

A great man named Charles Spurgeon once was quoted saying...

"Get your ( - - blocked - - ) to tell you your faults, or better still, welcome an enemy who will watch you keenly and sting you savagely. What a blessing such an irritating critic will be to a wise man, what an intolerable nuisance he'll be to a fool!"

I thank you for your comments and concerns. I apologize for any inconvenience these broken rods may have caused you to experience. My staff will work even harder at servicing customers such as yourself in the future. We do our best during the 9 hour days we work here at the office, then we clock out and go home to our families.

Just as I repeat myself over and over again in so many previous emails, I will say it once more. Our warranty is for those customers that need service under fair and ethically reasonable circumstances. Our business doesn't revolve around our warranty as we are not in business to replace rods at cost but rather sell rods, so that we can stay in business and continue to provide for our families, much like other businesses. It has been this way from the beginning and we plan on keeping it this way.

If companies like Loomis want to sell customers on their warranty instead of a superior innovative product, then so be it. We are not selling warranties, but tools that help the customers enjoy their sport more each day.

My staff go out of their way to try and satisfy each and every customer whether they are purchasing their first rod or sending in their broken rod. Everyone is treated with respect and appreciation in the most efficient manner possible on any given day.

The record speaks for itself when you take a look at our testimony page. In the case of this particular challenge, we will accept the fact that we are not perfect. We'll keep trying to be a perfect company no matter how challenging it gets because of the popularity and demand on our product. We will try to keep more rods in stock in the future to help supply any warranty replacement but sometimes, supply chains are challenged which leave us handicapped.

If there is anything I can do for you personally that will help you to become a totally satisfied customer of ours, please feel free to contact me privately. I am always available to assist anyone who has a complaint about my company. This public forum really is not the place to discuss this matter really, unless we deserved it. Which I don't think anyone ever really means to defame another business under circumstances so minor.

Alton Jones didn't break any when he won the Classic. But sometimes, there are bad batches of blanks that slip through the cracks. We will increase our testing before rods are shipped.

Monique is very well taken care of, in fact, she is treated better than family as well as given periodic bonuses for such great service. In fact, so are all my other office staff personnel. Ryan works harder than anyone I know at pleasing everyone he ever comes in contact with at Kistler Rods. Cindy is another jewel in our company that can take good care of anyone wanting quick and kind customer service. They all deserve more respect than this post might be lending.

At least 5 comments come in each day about how customers wish more and more companies would do business like Kistler Rods, because of how they were treated by my staff.

I hope I answered any and all questions that might have been asked previously.

Any responses should be respectful and factual following my statement. I would hate to have to pull this thread off our site. If it stays clean, then I'll keep it for all to see for years to come.

Thank you again for bringing this issue up so that we can address it asap, Trey Kistler

[Bill M]

Funny this post is here after my week long vacation/club tournament in the 1000 islands region of the St Lawrence seaway. My kistler LTA and reel seat seperated on a hook set to a pig smallie, the rod is 2 years old. The rod and reel seat now spin around. By the way lost the smallie

[skeeter20i]

Well guys, I felt I needed to put my two cents in on this subject. I have been fishing since I was 4 years old on the south Texas Gulf Coast and fell in love with fishing from the first fish I caught.Now at the old age of 35 I can say that I have had or used almost every brand rod, reel, lure, line, etc there is available. For a about a 4 year period I was spending over $2000 a month on tackle. In the time I have been fishing I have had problems with all types of equipment. It is just the way things are.

I have a 2006 truck, and have replaced the air conditioning compressor, and water pump on it. Does that mean that it is not a great truck? I don't expect the company to fix my truck for the entire life of the truck at their expense. If that was how every company in the USA was run the economy would be worse off than it is now.

I saw that Trey had mentioned sometimes that the rods are out of stock due to supply. I know that it is a problem sometimes getting the suppliers to deliver, or keep up with the components that are needed to build the rods. Kistler is not the only company that has these problems. I won't mention any names, but I have made orders to large tackle dealers in the past only to have several items on the orders I made to be out of stock, and back ordered. That is part of the supply and demand process. If it was not a good rod then they would always have rods in stock.

Kistler is one of the smaller rod companies out there and when a order comes in from Cabelas, or Gander Mountain they might want 500 HE66HC rods at once. That will take a big chunk out of the rods in stock. It is hard to determine what retailer is going to want, and the amount they are going to order at any one time.

I have been all over the Southern part of the USA fishing different tournaments. I know that at any given time a rod might break, a reel might break, or the trolling motor on my boat might burn up. I always have a backup in case that happens, it is part of the game when you fish tournaments. I know it is not easy buying all the equipment to cover that, especially what things cost these days, but I always have cheaper rods, reels, and a used trolling motor on hand.

Now as far as the customer service goes at Kistler, I have never dealt with a company with the quality of customer service Kistler has. If it took Ryan a little while to get back to you, it is because he was busy. Ryan does not just sit behind a desk all day long looking at a computer screen, or talking on the phone. From what I heard from people that have gone to visit Kistler; Ryan has several different things he is responsible for at Kistler, from building custom rods for customers, to talking to people about rod concerns, or ordering new rods.

I am sorry that you were not happy with your experience with Kistler Rods, and hope you are happy with you decision to go elsewhere. As for me I will stick with a product that helps me feel the slightest bite, is light as a feather, has the best customer service I have found, and is always setting the standard for other rod companies to follow. I have seen several of the designs that Trey first come out and incorporate on his rods now being copied by other rod companies. Good luck in the future.

[Ray Long]

I will have to agree with skeeter20i. I have been fishing with Kistler rods now for about 5 years and I can honestly say, these rods are better than any other rod that I have owned in over 25 years of fishing. I have had only one rod break on me in the 5 years I have been fishing with Kistler and the customer service there was great. The rod was over 1 year old and I knew what it was going to cost me and when I sent it back to Kistler and I had my new rod back within 2 weeks with no problems. I have contacted the customer service at Kistler on numerous occasions and I have never had a bit of trouble, they have always been very professional and very polite. I am very sorry for your troubles, but I can promise you, this will not happen very often. The Kistler Rods and the Kistler customer service, it just doesn't get any better than that and I say this with multiple experiences. I to will be sticking with Kistler rods from here on out, I can't see myself stop using a great rod just from one bad experience.

[Gary Hare]

I've been using Kistler Rods for about 2 yrs now. I've had 1 rod break on me while fishing. I called Kistler and explained to them what happen. It was a year old rod,so I needed to send them the replacement cost. Which I was hapy to do. Trey and the whole Kistler Staff have the best customer service around.
As has been stated in the previous posts. There are times with every company that items will be out of stock. It's just the way things are. I've had items that have been backordered and such in the past and it will happen again. It the way of supply and demand. I'm sorry for your bad experience with Kistler Rods. All rods will break and at times the staff will get very busy. But, all said and done Kistler does have the best customer service around in my book.

[Bill M]

Dont get me wrong, I still love the Kistler rods, this one that spun on me was purchased as a Christmas gift from Cabelas by my Wife and Son, they are very sensitive and casting a lure is a dream, I know "Chit" happens on the best stuff out there, its the way it is, nothing is perfect.

[Seymour]

Don't get me wrong either... I too, love the rods. They are my favorite rods on the market. And I haven't broken one yet. And the three I have get used the most. But I still keep my arsenal of Loomis rods in the boat. I just wish for something like the "Expeditor Service" that Loomis offers... where, if needed, I could get a rod shipped to me within 2-3 days and send the broken one back... even if it cost a lot more than the $65 Loomis wants for 2 day shipping. I'd pay in the range of $150 for a replacement Helium or $100 for a replacement Mg rod if it were older than a year. If something like that existed, I would probably replace all my Loomis rods.

[skeeter20i]

Seymour,

The expidited service might be something that might be a reality in the future when it is possible to do so. Kistler is always looking to make things better, and improve on their rods. The future will hold better things for the company, and in turn the customers.

Do you like Megabass?

[MAW]

Trey, I commend you on putting family first. Nothing in this world is more important than those who complete us.
I would also like to make it clear that NONE of the Kistler employees were disrespectful to me. Ryan was a tad curt but I retired from construction and factory work and don't ruffle easily.

All,
Do a word search on this forum for "broken" or "snapped" or any of the common words to denote a rod failure and tell me how many were not covered by warranty. I didn't find any, did you? How many of you who stated you expected to pay the replacement costs were talking about $172+ and not $35. I'll be honest, it caught me off guard.

Mine is a real life, real time experience. It does not belong in the testimonials so I thought the public forum was the right place. People need to know that things aren't always bread and honey.
I just expected parity treatment , nothing more, and feel I didn't get it.
In my opinion, 10 days with no contact at all is unacceptable.
In my opinion, telling someone you'll call them right back and then leaving them hang close to the phone for over six hours is also unacceptable.
I love the rods but, again my opinion, they are more of a race horse and not so much a work horse.
Trey can have any kind of warranty he wants, he can produce any kind of rod he wants and I don't have a problem with that. I do however, have a problem being treated differently than I had been led to expect.

[Shawn_Carter]

We'll first off i want to say that i am a proud owner of only one kistler custom rod so far BUT ONLY because i have not made a purchase for my new rods (there going to be KISTLER you will find out why soon ) . I recently fished a tournament in which MR. TREY KISTLER himself donated over 40 KISTLER CUSTOM RODS , the best part about it is that it was called " TAKE A SOLDIER FISHING DAY" meaning 40 of us boaters took out 40 soldiers for a fun day on Toledo Bend lake ...i dont know about u but when a company such as KISTLER supports an event and takes money out of there pocket and gives it just because a fellow angler and friend of mine named Andrew Upshaw called and asked if they could help and they had the rods there in like 3 days , ok thats something that most companys would have to think about and go through tons of people to even try to approve . KISTLER did it to commend and thank our armed forces for all they do on a daily basis, that makes me want to back them !!!!! At the end of the day me and the soldeir Cory Jeffres that fished with me ( - - blocked - - ) in 1st place and were both presented with KISTLER Rods i cant explain the look on his face when i told him how much his rod was worth he said AND THEY ARE JUST GIVING THESE TO US ?? I will support Kistler rods until i am proven wrong ...... THANKS AGAIN TREY FOR MAKING MY FIRST MEMORIES OF KISTLER CUSTOM RODS AND YOU YOURSELF VERY TOP NOTCH ...KEEP YOUR RODS LITE AND YOUR LINES TIGHT........Shawn Carter

[aquademon17]

I don't get some of the people. I've worked in retail 20 yrs., and what I think it boils down to is you just can't make some people happy, no matter what you say or how hard you try. No matter what explanation you give, it's just not good enough. In this day and age, some people want everything for nothing. If you want quality, you pay for it. I own 15 Kistler Rods, from the Graphite Plus to the LTX. I've sent 2 rods back for warranty claims, and had NO PROBLEMS!!The turn around they state on the warranty is when I recieved my rods back. Trey and his staff were awesome, and frankly gave the best customer service I have ever had.The follow up on the claim was extremely professional, and was surprised that there was a follow up. Try getting that with Loomis. The staff at Kistler cares about thier customers,That's why Trey spends time on here replying,and his customer service staff spends time following up.Everything in business has a learning curve, and they listen to thier customers feedback, good and bad. Unfortunately, MAW is trying to get something for nothing.Some advice for you.All fishing rods break,nothing lasts forever(except death and taxes),treat people the way you want to be treated and follow the rules..you may be surprised with the result...

[Gibby]

I recently bought a Helium II LTX flipping rod. I have to say I thought hard about whether or not to spend that much money on a rod and even called around to a few tackle stores to see if they've heard about rods breaking. I also called Kistler and asked about the warranty and was a little taken back that there was a charge and pro-ration cost to have rods replaced under warranty. Well, obvioulsy I went for the purchase anyway. Wouldn't you know it, the first morning I fished with the rod I snapped it in two places on a hook set about 2 hours into fishing. Even though the rod got replaced for free since it was within 90 days, it still cost me about $15 to mail it there. Needless to say I'm pretty disappointed and don't have a lot of confidence that the replacement rod will last very long before it goes snap. I hope I'm wrong since these rods are light and sensative, but it might be the last Kistler I buy.

[MAW]

Come on Aquademon17, you really need to open the garage door when you sit in the boat and spray your lures, snorting that much "Bang" obviously isn't good for you.
I would like to know just what it is you think I'm trying to get for nothing? I invested nearly $1000 with Kistler and that doesn't seem like nothing to me.
Or, maybe you figure that since I don't have 15 Kistlers, like you do, I'm not entitled to the same level of service and professionalism you received.
Had you bothered to actually try to comprehend what you were reading, you would have seen that posting your experience with Kistler does nothing but reinforce what I have said.
I played by the rules, I did everything Kistler asked me to do and it was Kistler that went out of bounds - not me.

Every coin has two sides. Hopefully, the side I've seen doesn't come up very often but people need to know it's there. Personally, I didn't care for it.